The Senate Trial of Donald J Trump for High Crimes

[spacemonkey]

The Dem's have no message other then Trump must go. OK, Trump goes , then what??? Crickets, lol.

[Saz]

[Philly]

[John Galt]

If you read spacemonkey's reactions to what Philly is saying it's kind of hilarious. Philly is saying that the democrats with Bernie are forging their own policy that isn't simply about Team Blue but rather about what they want for the country and spacemonkey replied that the democrats are only about anti-Trump. while democrats are understandably anti-Trump, they are not only about that.

i'm skeptical about some of the proposals of bernie, but I actually support a lot of what he is proposing.

as someone concerned about the fiscal outlook of the country, i support 'medicare for all' simply because it will save the american people money. that it has added health benefits is good but the healthcare system is so fundamentally broken as is it needs a complete rehaul.

as for the green new deal, i think something significant has to happen and it has to require government intervention.

i like ideas like banking from post offices, and getting broadband for everyone. these types of infrastructure investments pay dividends far into the future.

i don't approve of college for all -- i think instead we should have community college classes free for all, including 80 year old adults if they want -- and to actually end all subsidies of 4 year colleges.

i certainly don't want him taking my so-called 'assault weapon'. while i support expanded background checks and am actually fine with registering it, i must be given guarantees that registering it would never result in the government taking it (eg in the law that if it is ever modified the entire database must be destroyed or everyone on it gets a billion dollars each or something). i also don't think we should be banning what people can create at home with a printer.

i similarly in no way support national rent control. it's the exact wrong thing to do, as economists have near-unanimously pointed out. i'd be okay with investment for public-housing but rent control leads to never upgrading or fixing anything. i think YANG had a much better idea instead of any of that -- UBI

I also don't like the idea of a "guaranteed job for all". again, UBI seems better here, as it addresses issues and allows people to do what they want to do. providing opportunities is good, such as jobs in construction and whatnot for infrastructure initiatives, but frankly the 'jobs for all' is the most soviet style idea he has and it's an anathema to everything america stands for


that all said, I'll gladly vote for him. i doubt he'd have the political capital to do the things that I think are frankly unamerican ('guaranteed job for all') so it's okay. and he'd move the country in the correct direction, anyway

[Philly]

Depending on which part of the Democratic Party hes looking at, I could forgive spacemonkey for concluding they only care about being anti trump. As I’ve mentioned elsewhere, the Dem strategy for decades has been to sell themselves as a reprieve from the negatives of the GOP rather than a party with an affirmative case about themselves.

The #Resistance libs have embraced people like David Frum and Bill Kristol as heroes, simply because they dislike Trump. Forget the fact that their fingerprints are all over the worst US foreign policy debacle in modern history. And forget the fact that their opposition to Trump is based in his failure to consistently adhere to the neocon orthodoxy. All that matters is that they don’t like Trump.

In the 2000’s - really not that long ago - Bush and Cheney were the ultimate villains to the Democrats. What the Dems actually were, as the party of Al Gore and John Kerry, was really not very well defined, but they certainly weren’t Bush and Cheney. Now, Trump is the ultimate villain and now Bush’s henchmen and cheerleaders are in the Big Tent because they are not Trump.

The Sanders wing has an affirmative identity and is premised on the idea that the establishment democrat “big tent” really just accommodates a diverse coalition of the political and media class, but those people’s broad range of views do not represent any broad constituency of the american public. We are against Trump but would also tell Frum and Kristol to f**k off because we believe our own agenda is one that has the support of the American people and Frum/Kristol are against basically all of it.

We are committed to this because spacemonkey isn’t wrong: when Trump is gone, then what? For a large number of Democrats, the answer is “well, whatever comes next, at least Civil Respectable People will be in the whitehouse again”. And that’s exactly why the Republicans never have to clean their act up and become a less despicable party. They can just come back in a few years, more awful than ever, and be given another chance.

[Kane]

[John Galt]

They need the Sergeant at arms to arrest people, something the supreme Court has repeatedly said the congress can do

[Kane]

Just one guy eh?

Keep the violators in the basement? This could easily devolve into Congress having hiring an entire department and then you'd potentially have a showdown between Law Enforcement at the Executive and Congress' sergeant at arms. None of this was well thought out - I think this was an afterthought because the founders assumed the public would hold their representatives to account.

[John Galt]

[Kane]

I just don't see that ending well. Especially today.