Antifa

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Re: Antifa

Postby John Galt » Fri Apr 28, 2017 7:53 am

Winchester wrote:
John Galt wrote:
The Comrade wrote:should have just kicked out the republicans.


then the terrorists win

i mean literally the terrorists win then


Maybe, with this kinda shit in Berkeley and now this, these stupid f**k are hurting their cause.


"don't let republicans in the parade or we will terrorize the parade"
Americans learn only from catastrophe and not from experience. -- Theodore Roosevelt
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Re: Antifa

Postby Winchester » Fri Apr 28, 2017 8:23 am

John Galt wrote:
Winchester wrote:
John Galt wrote:
The Comrade wrote:should have just kicked out the republicans.


then the terrorists win

i mean literally the terrorists win then


Maybe, with this kinda shit in Berkeley and now this, these stupid f**k are hurting their cause.


"don't let republicans in the parade or we will terrorize the parade"


Well win in the short term, but f**k them.
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Re: Antifa

Postby exploited » Fri Apr 28, 2017 8:30 am

Remember, folks, antifa and their supporters are fundamentally childish people. They really and truly don't understand how this plays in wider society. Oh, sure, they understand that the normies don't like it, but they honestly believe they are accomplishing things that are both noteworthy and important.

You see, for most people, it is completely normal to have fantasies about dropping out of civil society, burning your own path and really going hard against the injustices of this world. But part of that normality is eventually realizing that humanity does not often move quickly - and when it does, the bodies pile up in short order. This is why people "sell out" - i.e. become productive members of society, pursuing their political goals in socially acceptable ways, doing all the boring and non-adventurous stuff like door-knocking and mailing lists and town halls, etc. It isn't glorious or exciting - after all, there is never a need to cover your face in a black mask and punch people in the head, then go break store windows in defiance of the capitalist machine. And it is actually way more difficult, because you can't just start hitting people, you have to appeal to their interests, emotions or sensibilities. You may even have to spend time with people you don't like, working with them and talking to them and perhaps even helping them as a means of building a better relationship.

What it comes down to is the same urges and inclinations that drive radicalism in every culture - we could be talking about jihadists, or cult members, or the Nazis themselves. Obviously we can't equivocate here - I'm referring to the more general driving forces behind these mindsets. Alienation, social inadequacy, out of control idealism, impatience and a total rejection of alternative ways of thinking. Sad to see a guy like Comrade caught up - even just passively - in that kind of retardation.

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Re: Antifa

Postby John Galt » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:31 am

absolutely correct exploited

and lets look at what this spawned:

http://reason.com/blog/2017/04/26/portl ... tand-again

The drama centers around the inclusion of the Multnomah County Republican Party (MCRP) in the 82nd Avenue of Roses Parade, which begins the city's Rose Festival.

Trouble began when Antifa leftist activists—acting under the monikers Direct Action Alliance and Oregon Students Empowered—created Facebook events which promised to confront the MCRP for the usual charges of hate mongering and fascism normalizing.

For the uninitiated, Antifa—short for anti-fascism—is a loose connection of anarcho-communists groups who seek to undermine the oppressive capitalist system we all toil under, mostly through blocking traffic and setting garbage cans on fire.


...


For the record, it's hard to think of a more embattled and despised minority than Portland-area Republicans.

James Buchal, chairman of the MCRP, said that the group was certainly concerned about threats from Antifa groups —which included promises on social media that Republican marchers would be "stabbed to death"—but said he was still saddened by the cancelling of the parade.

"Its a tradition," he says of the parade. "We march, the Democrats march, even the Greens now march." He noted that the MCRP had marched in every Avenue of the Roses parade without incident since he has been chairman.

Not helping the MCRP any was the promise from Joey Gibson—of the Facebook page Patriot Prayer—to also march in the 82nd Avenue of Roses parade as a means of protecting Portland Republicans.

Gibson released a video on Patriot Prayer's page Monday in which he ranted about his plans to confront any masked Antifa who dared to not show their face on the day, blending a professed support for free speech with grade-school level taunts.

"There's going to be a bunch of us going down on Saturday. You know the place, you know the time," he said in the video. "If you want to hurt us and you want to kill us, well the real men will be down there, and we'll be waiting."


so the threats have actually caused people to want to go act as vigilante protection crew for the parade. perhaps this was the point, to get people to actually act like that. as ex has already noted, most people want things to continue on in a normal orderly fashion. they dont want disturbances. if people want to go parade, fine. whatever, but if you're threatening to stab people to death if they are in a parade, some people might put on some sort of drab -- lets call it brown -- upper body apparel and walk around for protecting the peaceful parade participants. and then a confrontation appears. it just ratchets this shit up, leading to the very thing they hoped they would end by stabbing people to death for marching in a parade. who would have ever thought
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Re: Antifa

Postby The Comrade » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:32 am

Direct action is painful to the bootlicker

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Re: Antifa

Postby exploited » Fri Apr 28, 2017 10:53 am

lmao
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Re: Antifa

Postby spacemonkey » Fri Apr 28, 2017 11:27 am

Freedom of speech at UC, Berkley is dead. end of story. **==
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Re: Antifa

Postby NAB » Fri Apr 28, 2017 11:40 am

exploited wrote:Remember, folks, antifa and their supporters are fundamentally childish people. They really and truly don't understand how this plays in wider society. Oh, sure, they understand that the normies don't like it, but they honestly believe they are accomplishing things that are both noteworthy and important.

You see, for most people, it is completely normal to have fantasies about dropping out of civil society, burning your own path and really going hard against the injustices of this world. But part of that normality is eventually realizing that humanity does not often move quickly - and when it does, the bodies pile up in short order. This is why people "sell out" - i.e. become productive members of society, pursuing their political goals in socially acceptable ways, doing all the boring and non-adventurous stuff like door-knocking and mailing lists and town halls, etc. It isn't glorious or exciting - after all, there is never a need to cover your face in a black mask and punch people in the head, then go break store windows in defiance of the capitalist machine. And it is actually way more difficult, because you can't just start hitting people, you have to appeal to their interests, emotions or sensibilities. You may even have to spend time with people you don't like, working with them and talking to them and perhaps even helping them as a means of building a better relationship.

What it comes down to is the same urges and inclinations that drive radicalism in every culture - we could be talking about jihadists, or cult members, or the Nazis themselves. Obviously we can't equivocate here - I'm referring to the more general driving forces behind these mindsets. Alienation, social inadequacy, out of control idealism, impatience and a total rejection of alternative ways of thinking. Sad to see a guy like Comrade caught up - even just passively - in that kind of retardation.


Quick "fixes" can't solve complex problems. Not that it's exclusive to our era, but the rise of instant communication/gratification/dopaminefication makes trying to solve complex and time consuming problems that much more difficult.
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Re: Antifa

Postby NAB » Fri Apr 28, 2017 11:42 am

Cute

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Re: Antifa

Postby exploited » Fri Apr 28, 2017 12:24 pm

NAB wrote:
exploited wrote:Remember, folks, antifa and their supporters are fundamentally childish people. They really and truly don't understand how this plays in wider society. Oh, sure, they understand that the normies don't like it, but they honestly believe they are accomplishing things that are both noteworthy and important.

You see, for most people, it is completely normal to have fantasies about dropping out of civil society, burning your own path and really going hard against the injustices of this world. But part of that normality is eventually realizing that humanity does not often move quickly - and when it does, the bodies pile up in short order. This is why people "sell out" - i.e. become productive members of society, pursuing their political goals in socially acceptable ways, doing all the boring and non-adventurous stuff like door-knocking and mailing lists and town halls, etc. It isn't glorious or exciting - after all, there is never a need to cover your face in a black mask and punch people in the head, then go break store windows in defiance of the capitalist machine. And it is actually way more difficult, because you can't just start hitting people, you have to appeal to their interests, emotions or sensibilities. You may even have to spend time with people you don't like, working with them and talking to them and perhaps even helping them as a means of building a better relationship.

What it comes down to is the same urges and inclinations that drive radicalism in every culture - we could be talking about jihadists, or cult members, or the Nazis themselves. Obviously we can't equivocate here - I'm referring to the more general driving forces behind these mindsets. Alienation, social inadequacy, out of control idealism, impatience and a total rejection of alternative ways of thinking. Sad to see a guy like Comrade caught up - even just passively - in that kind of retardation.


Quick "fixes" can't solve complex problems. Not that it's exclusive to our era, but the rise of instant communication/gratification/dopaminefication makes trying to solve complex and time consuming problems that much more difficult.


Social media has played a large part in this, IMO. Most of these actions are organized over social media, and the nature of the technology makes it quite easy to shut down any dissenting opinions or suggestions, and only organize with those who walk in lock-step with your opinions. This causes loose organizations like Antifa from embarrassing themselves by doing things like shutting down a parade that prides itself on "volunteerism, patriotism and environmentalism" - if they had been given the opportunity to talk with somebody outside the bubble, they might have at least been aware of how poorly perceived this would be.

Beyond that, I think most of this can be blamed on simple arrogance. Antifa is adamant that what they are doing is correct, not because of any particular achievement, but because they are the ones doing it. They are not racist, sexist, ableist, etc. so how can what they do be negative? How can they be blamed or looked down upon when they stand so firmly against those (admittedly terrible) values?

I can only hope that Antifa participants and supporters keep their passion, but learn how to harness it into productive and effective actions. There is a role for the revolutionary left - but that role is in factories, farms and fast-food restaurants, not on 82nd Avenue. Too bad they don't have any adult direction.
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