Why they support the Iran nuclear deal

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Re: Why they support the Iran nuclear deal

Postby spacemonkey » Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:30 am

Someone has to be the first to set one off and be made an example of. May as well be those fools. Although I thought N Korea might get that honor, but it seems not.
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Re: Why they support the Iran nuclear deal

Postby Kane » Wed Aug 19, 2015 12:05 pm

Medius wrote:
exploited wrote:You'd win every battle and lose the war.


We'll lose every war in the middle east. I don't get how our top military geniuses haven't figured this one out yet. They don't measure wars in days or weeks like we do, they measure them in hundreds of years.


It's a different metric that doesn't require a "win" to be successful. It's merely posturing as well as asserting dominance over a region in order to keep other geopolitical competitors at bay. Lose the Iraq war? Meh. We've still got military dominance in the region which tends to keep the power players in the area more to our whims.

The top military geniuses know this.
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Re: Why they support the Iran nuclear deal

Postby Libertarian602 » Wed Aug 19, 2015 12:20 pm

Indy wrote:
Libertarian602 wrote:Lol, you're the one making the unfounded assertion that the most powerful military in the world, with a unmatched heavy lift capability, sixty years of tried and proven Forced Air-insertion capabilities, the largest navy, the largest and most advanced air capability, couldn't successfully invade Iran.

And, you're basing this off of what??


I'm basing it off of what you would call "success." Why the f___ would we invade Iran? What would be the end game?

I mean, all this dick-swinging is great and stuff, but we invaded C-list Iraq with their broken down military and supposedly pro-U.S. population and we ended up stuck there for more than a decade, lost over 4,400 Americans, tens of thousands more were maimed for life and we lost trillions of dollars.

So yeah, can't wait to hear the plan for how this Iran invasion just screams "success" waiting to happen. Really.

Once again, you seem confused between the difference in the occupation of Iran, and the invasion of Iran.
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Re: Why they support the Iran nuclear deal

Postby Spider » Wed Aug 19, 2015 1:37 pm

Libertarian602 wrote:
Indy wrote:
Libertarian602 wrote:Lol, you're the one making the unfounded assertion that the most powerful military in the world, with a unmatched heavy lift capability, sixty years of tried and proven Forced Air-insertion capabilities, the largest navy, the largest and most advanced air capability, couldn't successfully invade Iran.

And, you're basing this off of what??


I'm basing it off of what you would call "success." Why the f___ would we invade Iran? What would be the end game?

I mean, all this dick-swinging is great and stuff, but we invaded C-list Iraq with their broken down military and supposedly pro-U.S. population and we ended up stuck there for more than a decade, lost over 4,400 Americans, tens of thousands more were maimed for life and we lost trillions of dollars.

So yeah, can't wait to hear the plan for how this Iran invasion just screams "success" waiting to happen. Really.

Once again, you seem confused between the difference in the occupation of Iran, and the invasion of Iran.


You're talking about the ideal: Simply blow it up and immediately go home, thus denying them the opportunity to build a glorious insurgency and start scoring CNN points.

Won't happen.
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Re: Why they support the Iran nuclear deal

Postby Indy » Wed Aug 19, 2015 2:30 pm

Once again, you seem confused between the difference in the occupation of Iran, and the invasion of Iran.


Oh, so we're just going to invade and then bounce, huh? So it's going to be an occupation-less invasion. I see.

LOL!!!!!!!!
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Re: Why they support the Iran nuclear deal

Postby Medius » Wed Aug 19, 2015 2:55 pm

Spider wrote:
Libertarian602 wrote:
Indy wrote:
Libertarian602 wrote:Lol, you're the one making the unfounded assertion that the most powerful military in the world, with a unmatched heavy lift capability, sixty years of tried and proven Forced Air-insertion capabilities, the largest navy, the largest and most advanced air capability, couldn't successfully invade Iran.

And, you're basing this off of what??


I'm basing it off of what you would call "success." Why the f___ would we invade Iran? What would be the end game?

I mean, all this dick-swinging is great and stuff, but we invaded C-list Iraq with their broken down military and supposedly pro-U.S. population and we ended up stuck there for more than a decade, lost over 4,400 Americans, tens of thousands more were maimed for life and we lost trillions of dollars.

So yeah, can't wait to hear the plan for how this Iran invasion just screams "success" waiting to happen. Really.

Once again, you seem confused between the difference in the occupation of Iran, and the invasion of Iran.


You're talking about the ideal: Simply blow it up and immediately go home, thus denying them the opportunity to build a glorious insurgency and start scoring CNN points.

Won't happen.


Careful, the assertion was that the United States was incapable. Not that we shouldn't not that we'd screw it up. But that it couldn't be done.

I don't disagree with you, but we are talking about two different things.
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Re: Why they support the Iran nuclear deal

Postby exploited » Wed Aug 19, 2015 3:16 pm

Galt's prediction of words having no meaning is quickly coming true for some.
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Re: Why they support the Iran nuclear deal

Postby Spider » Wed Aug 19, 2015 6:48 pm

Medius wrote:
Careful, the assertion was that the United States was incapable. Not that we shouldn't not that we'd screw it up. But that it couldn't be done.

I don't disagree with you, but we are talking about two different things.


I don't think it can be done, politically. The military is extremely good at pulverizing things. It wouldn't take long to reduce Iran to a depopulated smoldering ruin, if the military were allowed to operate within its full "wrecking ball" capability. However, politics are the actual throttle on military action...and 4G Warfare being what it is...there simply isn't any practical way to work out a "blow it up and go home" approach.

We don't do this long occupation, "hearts and minds", "regime change" shit because we really want to, or because we think its actually a winning strategy...we do it because its what's required by the talking heads and the elected guys in the smoke-filled rooms.

If we just wanted to make certain Iran doesn't get the bomb, we could bludgeon them until they are physically incapable of making anything more complicated than a cement mixer. But...that's just not a possibility anymore. The world is too small.
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Re: Why they support the Iran nuclear deal

Postby Philly » Wed Aug 19, 2015 6:50 pm

eynon81 wrote:
Indy wrote:They want one for the same reason that all the nations in that region want one: warhead envy.

If Iran were to get one they'd be a nuclear superpower and of course the other nations wouldn't stand for being relegated to the kids' table so this would set off a nuclear arms race in just the part of the country where you don't want there to be... a nuclear arms race.

Although I say this as we've had no problem with super-scary Pakistan having nukes for decades now.

It has nothing to do with them nuking us--they won't--or Israel, either which would be suicidal.



yeah no dude, this is a legit national security issue for them. Iran has been invaded numerous times in the last 100 years (Russia, Brits, Iraq) and the world's largest super-power is threatening to invade them...they want the bomb to help protect national sovereignty. This is why even liberal iranians want the bomb.

Just going to quote this eynon post because it lays everything out. Not everything is about our politics and what our leaders would feel compelled to do in an invasion of Iran. The Iranians aren't going to feel safe without a nuke because our domestic politics would make invading them difficult.
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Re: Why they support the Iran nuclear deal

Postby Libertarian602 » Mon Aug 24, 2015 10:21 pm

Indy wrote:
Once again, you seem confused between the difference in the occupation of Iran, and the invasion of Iran.


Oh, so we're just going to invade and then bounce, huh? So it's going to be an occupation-less invasion. I see.

LOL!!!!!!!!

Ya, we've never done that before. Except for the first gulf war, panama, gerneda, Dominican Republic, and Mexico.

Stop doubling down on dumb.
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